Webinar: Permitting and Site Selection Strategies for EV Charging Infrastructure (Text Version)

This is a text version of Webinar: Permitting and Site Selection Strategies for EV Charging Infrastructure, presented on Feb. 13, 2024.

Permitting and Site Selection Strategies for EV Charging Infrastructure

Bridget Gilmore: The disclaimer, this webinar is being recorded and may be posted on the Joint Office website or used internally. And if you speak during the webinar or use video, you are presumed to consent to recording and use of your voice or image.

By way of agenda, we'll just do a really brief introduction from the Joint Office, and then have our great presenters joining us today. We have Emily Kotz, Courtney Ferguson, Alisha Lopez, and Roy Eden. And then we will save time for a great panel discussion and hear from you all any questions that you might have.

So just a little bit about the Joint Office, we are a federal office between the U.S. Department of Energy and US Department of Transportation. We were established with the bipartisan infrastructure law. And we are looking to enable a future where everyone can ride and drive electric.

We are supporting four main programs by providing guidance, technical assistance, and analysis support. So that's the NEVI program, the Charging & Fueling Infrastructure Discretionary Program, the Low-No Program for transit buses and the Clean School Bus program at EPA.

Great, so I will now pause for just our two quick polling questions. So, we are going to figure out who's in the room here today. Who was able to make it, so Haylee, if you don't mind launching our first question when you get a chance.

Awesome. Thank you. So, the first question is, what region of the country are you from? So, I'll give folks just a second to respond. And once it's looking like votes have started to settle, we can close that one out.

Great, looks like a really nice spread across the country, folks from all over joining. We've got three people internationally. That's exciting. Thank you all so much for joining.

We can go to our second polling question, looking at what industry folks are coming from generally. Yeah, the second one, Haylee. Awesome. Thank you.

Great, so we'll just give folks a couple minutes. I guess not even minutes, 30 seconds to respond to this one. All righty, our votes settling in. Great. Thank you so much.

So yeah, it looks like we've got a lot of folks from local and regional governments today. That's exciting and also a lot of folks from the EV industry. Thanks for joining us. Appreciate you being here.

So, we can keep rolling. So next up, I'm going to introduce our great speakers who are here with us today. We have Emily Kotz from the National Renewable Energy Laboratory. Emily is a transportation research project leader, and she provides technical assistance to support communities and fleets in their efforts towards electrification.

We're also joined by Courtney Ferguson from OWL Services. Courtney has eight years of experience in the financial industry in compliance and operations. And then she has now transitioned to a decade-long role in the construction sector, focusing on renewable energy. She has exceptional leadership and has earned her esteemed One Way One Team One Goal Award at the OWL Summit. She's actively involved in the women of electric vehicles and WRISE, the Women of Renewable Energy Industries and Renewable Energy, and remains dedicated to promoting sustainability across a variety of fields.

We're also joined by Alisha Lopez who is the Clean Cities Director at the South Florida Regional Planning Council. In addition to her role as director, she was recently elected to the Drive Electric Florida Board of Directors. As the Infrastructure committee chair, Ms. Lopez is developing best practices and permitting guidelines for the state to promote the growth of electric vehicle use as one of the many alternative fuel options that advance the energy, economic, and environmental security of Florida.

And we're also joined by Roy Eden Roy serves as the building official for the permitting services division for the city of Orlando, and right here gave Alisha a wonderful presentation. So, we're excited to hear about his experiences on the ground.

So now I will pass it over to Emily to get us started.

Emily Kotz: Thanks Bridget, for that introduction. As Bridget noted, I work for the National Renewable Energy Lab, and I am one of many team members providing technical assistance to communities and states that reach out to the Joint Office.

You can move to the next slide, please Bridget. Thanks.

We wanted to make you aware that we recently published new information on the Alternative Fuels Data Center website related to state and local planning for electric vehicle charging station infrastructure. This new content focuses on how to create EV friendly regulations and policies, including a new section on electric vehicle permitting, which is very timely for our discussion here today.

The content provides high level overviews with links to best practices, resources, and example plans that you can reference, and also use to take a deeper dive into subject. What's great about this web content is that we plan to keep it updated. As we find new resources, we plan to add it to this page. So please come visit the website to this page. It's at the top right, and we'll also share it in the slides at the end of this presentation as well.

Bridget, if you can move to the next one. Thank you.

So electric vehicle permitting is an area where states and local governments can take action to reduce potential delays that projects may face when submitting a permit for approval. It takes time and resources from the applicant to prepare the submittal, but also for staff to review. When requirements for an EV permit are clearly listed, this leads to more complete submittals from the applicant and hopefully less time for staff spent reviewing this permit application.

When creating the new content for the EV permitting page on the AFDC, we reviewed a number of example communities that have adopted expedited EV permitting processes, as well as states that have published guidance. The new content provides a summary of resources with links to more information. And on this slide, we summarize the common themes for streamlining EV permitting that we noted during conversations with communities, as well as our review of the best practices and guides on this subject.

A lot of these themes I think you'll hear echoed by the other presenters here today. The first one is creating a standardized and transparent permit review process. This can include creating a checklist specific to EV charging stations that outline what is required for submittal. Second, simplifying the review and approval process such as allowing for concurrent review if multiple departments need to review, providing a complete deficiency notice and in some instances allowing for plans to be approved as noted.

And then the last one, adopting an online permitting process, many communities have already gone this route, especially in the post COVID era. But making this information available online, including accepting electronic submittals and signatures, a link to the checklist, and also providing timeline estimates can really help with streamlining. So I'm really excited to hear from our presenters here today. They have direct experience either submitting or reviewing EV permits, and looking forward to the lessons learned that they have to share.

But before moving on, Bridget, if you can go to the next slide.

I do want to cover and highlight a few of the resources that are available to communities looking for help with their EV infrastructure projects. The Joint Office has partnered with NREL to provide free, no strings attached, technical assistance to communities that have questions related to planning, deploying, or operating EV mobility technologies.

Maybe you have a simple question or are looking for a resource or an example. Or maybe you want to talk to someone on the phone for a few hours to help get started on a project, or to answer some technical questions. Or maybe you have a more complex, challenging request that is going to require more time and expertise.

We recommend that you go to driveelectric.gov/contact and make an inquiry. There's a simple quick form that won't take very much time at all for you to fill out. And that will put you in contact with us. We can then follow up and discuss a plan for how we can provide support.

We also are proactively working on resources and adding them to the community technical assistance and research page on driveelectric.gov, there are a number of great resources on that page already there today. And it's a great first stop to help you get started. So thanks, Bridget. I appreciate the time and being able to jump on today. But I'll pass it back to you to introduce the next presenter.

Bridget Gilmore: Great. Thank you so much, Emily. Yeah, Courtney if you want to come on and let us hear from you.

Courtney Ferguson: Hi. Thanks, Bridget. Thanks, Emily, for your presentation. Next slide? And you can go to next slide.

I just want to go over my presentation overview. It's really from the perspective of a general or electrical contractor in this public or private sectors of installations of L2 or L3 better known as DC fast chargers. The processes that we have taken to help us expedite or just at least follow the processes of working with the jurisdictions cohesively to start the projects.

You can go to the next slide.

What we found have worked out best is we've created an AHJ research document. And AHJ for those of you, it's called Authority Having Jurisdiction. They are the point of contact that we will go through the permitting process. Typically, every jurisdiction, which it could be from a city, a township, or a county, or you're dealing with both. Some have dual permitting processes that you have to get a permit or approval from the county before you can apply to the city or vice versa.

So, there's a lot of complexities that we have found that with this checklist, we make sure we cover all bases. So we don't pursue down one avenue and realize that we've got to go backwards and contact another jurisdiction to start a project. So making point of contact by phone, if there isn't some online portal that maps out all the requirements, we have found has been our best practices.

Then you also develop a relationship. You've got a name. Sometimes you'll get an email address, so there's someone you can communicate with through the process to ensure accuracy. Also just again, the required documentation, the qualifications, the licenses, the registrations– a lot of towns require you to do a contractor registration on both the electrical and as a general contractor. And these are also points that you have to send a check. You also provide the certificate before you can even apply for your permit, you'll have to provide that.

So these are all key factors that we have in place to streamline our permit process. And permit submission, we have seen various ways of this across the board. You either do by mail, email, or an online portal. And as Emily has said, streamlining that into an online submission has really helped move that process along. It also keeps track of when you submitted it, when the review process is when it's by mail.

It's definitely a lot more timely also by email, because the size of the documents sometimes you have to submit are larger than what they can receive. So you have to compress those files. So we found a lot of challenges with the email process. I will say definitely the online portal is the most preferred.

And also going back is different kinds of permits that are needed. With that first contact we find out there's a zoning permit review that needs to be done. And once that's passed through that phase, then you need a building, and then you need electricity, or then you need a fire. That is what we're also seeing as pretty much standard in a lot of jurisdictions.

So knowing exactly what you need to follow to go through the next steps is extremely important. And that's, again, what you find out with the research, and then through your permit submissions what you need to move on to the next through the process.

And then once you gone through the process, again, it can take weeks. This can take a year. We've seen all across the board. Again, standardizing that or somewhat close to having an idea of what that looks like as a contractor is very helpful for us to know when to schedule or at least understand when that project could possibly start. And then once the permit has been obtained, what those requirements are. Sometimes we do get the physical permit back. Sometimes it's all across the board. It's just an email or it's a receipt of payment.

And sometimes we don't even get the approved stamped drawings back. They're just there. So we use what we have. So there's a lot of things that really need to be standardized so there's less confusion and we know that we're building from the most approved stamp set that has the AHJ approval, so when there are inspections they have the same set that we do.

Bridget, next slide?

I just want to go over some questions that we have gathered. Some of the highlights of our AHJ research is plans, how would they like them on a PDF. Sometimes we send a zip drive. Or they want the actual hard copies. And there's times where I've sent 11 full sets, which is very pricey to a contractor to send, especially if it's going to cross country. The number, like I said, also if they have to be a wet seal, we get that very often as well.

And a property owner approval letter, that is something that is pretty standard as well through our permit process. And then landscaping requirements, this is something that plays into the design aspect of knowing what we need. Also, there might be some things that we have to do after, obviously, the project is complete.

And we always ask if we can expedite. There are a lot of jurisdictions that if we pay a little extra, this can get push to the top of the list. It is some standard practices across the country as the contractor. We like this. But we would like to have, again, a standard timeline or something that knows that it's never going to be longer than three-month review process. I think anything past that is really hard for a contractor to schedule their year.

Also, I think, again, with the permit fees is another big question. This is hard for budgeting. We've seen from $50 to $5,000 or more. So that is not standardized. It's really hard for us to go back to the customer saying this is going to cost us. And there's multiple layers of permit fees. So again, the thing that we're looking for on this side is to standardize.

Next slide, please, Bridget?

I just wanted to break down the different EV permits that my team, we apply for when we start a project. We always are asking about the zoning and building permits and electrical or standard for anything that is for an L2 or L3. Especially L2, if there is a new service that will be needed. Again, through those permits we are asking if there's any kind of inspection that are required through the construction process. Typically, they are.

And fire, that is like I said, a new one that we're seeing. Because this could be a fire hazard, they want to inspect the project and the location to make sure that there is no hazards for that.

Next slide?

Here's an example of just an EV charger permit application, which this is the goal I think that every jurisdiction should be striving for. I think this really hits every point that is needed. Also, it can really I think be a platform for everyone to utilize through their jurisdictions, like I said, through knowing what kind of low calc. Our chargers are installed based upon the manufacturer and also the utility grid of what we can do, so what kind of level of capacity we can have.

So the drawings that are needed, I think this really is a great example of a permit application that I would like to see and hopefully others utilize.

Next slide, please?

And again, to improve EV permitting, I think we're all probably going to echo this, Emily said. But just standardize the permit application I think either at a state level or federal, I think will really help streamline this industry into what everybody's goals are here is to promote the EV infrastructure. And we're wanting, for one, with the NEVI funding is to have EV chargers every 50 miles off the corridor. So this will help get that done.

Standardizing the review process and requirements, I know a lot of jurisdictions, they're just unfamiliar territory to them. So to have a lot of guidance, which I think this group here is helping provide that assistance, which I think is great resources. And I think the more we know, the more we can teach. And then the more we can all adapt. And then again, consistent compliance in the EV infrastructure, I think if we can standardize that on a state or federal level, I think it helps everybody on both sides of this industry.

Next slide?

And I just want to thank everybody for their time. And if you have any questions or need any help on the contractor side, please reach out to me. I'd love to help. Thank you.

Bridget Gilmore: Awesome. Thank you so much, Courtney. Really appreciate it. Now we can pass it over to Alisha.

Alisha Lopez: Thank you so much, Bridget. Thank you for the introduction. And I just wanted to thank all the attendees who are participating on the webinar today. And again, my name is Alisha Lopez. I'm the Clean Cities Director at the South Florida Regional Planning Council. And I will give a little bit of background on the council, the Clean Cities program, before we get into some of the feedback and best practices for EV permitting.

Next slide?

The South Florida Regional Planning Council was established in 1974, and is one of 10 regional planning councils in Florida. The regional planning councils are Florida's only multi-purpose regional entity that is in position to plan for and coordinate Intergovernmental solutions to growth-related problems on greater-than-local issues. We provide technical assistance to local governments and meet other needs of the communities in the region.

So our council serves three counties in South Florida, which is Monroe, Miami Dade, and Broward County which includes 71 municipalities and about 4 million residents. A few of the program areas at the council are the Clean Cities Program, economic development, local emergency planning, resiliency, transportation, and land use planning.

Next slide?

All right, the Clean Cities Coalition Network is a coordinated group of more than 75 active coalitions covering nearly every state, helping local decision makers and fleets understand and implement alternative and renewable fuels, idle reduction measures, fuel economy improvements, new mobility choices, and emerging transportation technologies. Clean Cities Coalitions foster the economic, environmental, and energy security of the United States by working locally to advance affordable domestic transportation fuels, energy efficient mobility systems, and other fuel saving technologies and practices.

So coalitions accomplish this mission by building partnerships with public and private sector transportation stakeholders. More than 84% of the US population lives inside Clean Cities Coalition boundaries. An active and diverse network of nearly 20,000 stakeholders– government agencies, industry representatives, community organizations, and businesses work through Clean Cities to exchange information and resources.

And due to my work with the Clean Cities program, I was nominated and selected to serve on the Board of Directors for Drive Electric Florida. Drive Electric Florida is a statewide nonprofit that assists with the acceleration of electrification in the state. I'm currently the Infrastructure Committee chair and help to develop a best practices guidance document for local governments in the state of Florida.

Next slide?

So working on this permitting document, we've definitely worked with a lot of stakeholders from local governments, state, EV installers, and just honestly EV just enthusiasts. One of the most important actions that state and local governments can take though to meet its climate and clean air goals, is to accelerate electrification of the transportation sector.

Florida has the second number of EV sales in the nation, and building out adequate charging infrastructure to support EV drivers is vitally important. Unfortunately, it is a long process to get charging infrastructure permitted, inspected, and interconnected.

Prior to any construction project, permits must be filed, reviewed, and approved with the local authority having jurisdiction to begin work. Many state, county, and local permitting processes lack dedicated pathways for electric vehicle supply equipment approval. That leads to burdensome and delayed deployments for our site hosts. These delays commonly push back project timelines by months, affecting business operations.

So some of the feedback was confusing and complex municipal codes, and associated permitting processes are commonly cited barriers to EV charger deployment. Many state, county, and local permitting processes lack dedicated pathways for EVSE approval. There's delays related to unstandardized permitting processes. It can add weeks to more than a year to have an EV charging infrastructure project and thousands of dollars in added costs. A streamlined and transparent permitting process is essential for swift expansion of EV charging.

Next slide?

And as Emily mentioned previously, there are few steps that local and state governments can do to make the permitting process a little bit more efficient. One, clearly describe the required steps, forms, submittals, and process of applying for an electric vehicle charging station permit. Local governments can streamline permit applications by directing them through a single department and through health and safety review.

If multiple departments are involved, the reviews should happen simultaneously instead of one department after another. The system should offer submission and payment mechanisms online. Ideally, this would be done through a dedicated portal and accept electronic signatures on permit applications.

Establish and communicate their permit review and approval processing times. Permit review and processing times can help manage customer expectations. Local governments can opt to provide a sample or target timelines, or they can require a turnaround time to make a permit as complete or incomplete.

Some states that have implemented statewide legislation are California, Delaware, and New Jersey. And a few municipalities that I wanted to highlight were the city of Chicago, the city of Sacramento, and the city of Orlando.

And you can go ahead and go on to the next slide.

And with that, I wanted to thank everyone for being here today. Thank you for your time. And I pass it back over to Bridget to introduce our next speaker.

Bridget Gilmore: Great. Thank you so much, Alisha. I know Roy, I think he is on the phone. But I'm not sure if he's able to join. Roy, are you there?

Knowing that there are a lot of folks on the line, I think I might move us over to our question-and-answer period, and we'll have the recording and the slides as well. So hopefully we can see Roy's information that way. But unfortunately, there are some technical difficulties. So I guess in the meantime, I can invite Alisha and Courtney back up, and we will dive into some of our questions. And Roy, if you are able to join us, and want to join in for any of the discussions, please do feel free.

But I know we actually had gotten a question just like what we were thinking would be a good one to kick us off on, is for communities that don't have any sort of EV permitting process. How do you recommend that they get started? What are some resources or examples that they could look to? I know you guys have mentioned some already. But I think it'd be good to hear a little bit more.

Alisha Lopez: No, definitely. I love the fact that Emily brought up the AFTC. That's definitely, I feel, a great place to start, especially for the permitting page that they have. Because it actually has in-step processes that local governments can take.

One thing that I definitely would love to recommend is if you know of a municipality or a state government that actually has EV permitting already in place, I would also pick up the phone and call them. You would be surprised at how many people are willing to help. This is all a new space for us. We're all in our growing pains, so really having that open communication, reaching out. Clean Cities, we are the troops on the ground floor. We know exactly what's going on within our region and our communities. They are a fantastic resource to plug into to get any kind of help.

I know that a few coalitions have actually helped develop some EV ordinances for some local communities. So definitely, I would say reach out. Clean Cities, of course, first, and then local governments. But Courtney, you can go ahead. I don't know if you want to add anything else.

Courtney Ferguson: No, I agree with everything that you're saying. I've actually had experience with that with Illinois. We had a client who was wanting to put EV chargers in. And they just didn't have any place to start. So we, just from our experience with other surrounding jurisdictions, put them in contact. They developed EV permitting process and application and knew how to take this off. So I love that.

I think also GO-Biz, I think we put this– you'll have the link at the end of this presentation. I think they've got some great permitting guidebook. Again, I just like Alisha said, there's a lot of resources out there. But I think using your surrounding communities, because you're dealing with the same elements. There's a lot of geographic similarities that is where your best resource is going to come from. And instead of somebody from a completely different side of the country, I think you have different things that will be as challenges. So I like that advice, Alisha.

Bridget Gilmore: Great. I see another question has come in. How can state departments of transportation support AHJs or local governments as they are developing these permitting approaches? You all have any experience with that kind of partnership happening at the state level?

Alisha Lopez: I have not yet. But definitely I was thinking that with the NEVI funding that they might start reaching out to those local governments. Because I know that the state DOTs had to nominate alternative fuel corridors. And a lot of those are major highways. So they go through a majority of the communities within either that state or region.

So I know here in Florida, they've been more focused on figuring out how to do the deployment and that aspect and updates on the NEVI. But as far as I know, Florida hasn't necessarily started working with the DOT. But, I don't know, Courtney, if you've had any experience with state DOTs working with local jurisdictions.

Courtney Ferguson: I think it's just making sure everyone follows all the requirements and codes, and at a timely basis and that information is delivered. I think as we all are building this infrastructure, we're learning as we go. And there's a lot of changing parts. So sometimes there's projects that may have started. And they're like, oh, we need to make sure we're covering this.

So I think just communication and getting back out to everybody who's involved in this project is key. So when we have on-site inspectors excuse me from each jurisdiction working with us, I mean everybody wants to do this the right way, the safe way for everything. So it's just working together and communication is key in this, as we're all learning as we're laying this out.

Bridget Gilmore: Yeah. Thank you for that. I thought it was great how you both had talked about just picking up the phone and calling someone, and actually finding a person who is at the other end trying to really help you troubleshoot, and that relationship aspect of things I think has been really interesting here.

I think another good question that's come in is what are some of the permits that the utilities might have to acquire for the upstream end of the charging infrastructure work. So I guess do you all have thoughts of the utility permit side of things?

Courtney Ferguson: As an electrical, I'm trying to understand if that's what that question is.

Bridget Gilmore: Yeah.

Courtney Ferguson: I think it's just based upon load counts. And I think that's, again, I think that falls on the jurisdiction side, the AHJ. And I really wish Roy could comment on this. I think this would be a great question for him to answer here.

Roy Eden: Can you hear me?

Courtney Ferguson: Oh, yes. Actually, great.

Alisha Lopez: We can hear you.

Bridget Gilmore: Perfect.

Roy Eden: All right. OK, welcome.

Bridget Gilmore: Phone a friend.

Courtney Ferguson: Welcome, yeah.

Roy Eden: Yeah, this has been quite a challenge. I haven't been able to see any of the presentations. I don't know how– if you have my presentation. If you wanted to share it with the group. Our permitting process and the question that you had, was do utilities– utilities are regulated under a separate code in Florida. Whereas building codes are regulated under the National Electric Code, the NEC.

So if it was provided by the utility in say a public right of way, I believe they could be exempt from certain criteria. And they would have to perform their own service connections, if that makes sense, because it's unmetered at that point, through the cities. But our permitting process, do you want me to go through the slide presentation?

Bridget Gilmore: It's up to you, Roy, I think if it's hard without seeing it, if I share my screen, are you able to see it?

Roy Eden: I have a copy on my desk, and I could just say. Next.

Bridget Gilmore: OK, great.

Roy Eden: I'll just introduce, I can just introduce myself, I guess. My name's Roy Eden. I'm a building official for the city of Orlando. And we worked diligently on streamlining the EV process when we first got started electrifying all of our local, city recreation centers and facilities. I think we did like 67 of them. The codes are at least three years behind, if not further, from the technology. And so we tried to apply the codes, as we would look at this as just the installation of electrical equipment.

So there's a permit required to be the next slide. And in the state of Florida, we require a permit as well as licensed professional contractors. And as we go through the process– I'll take you to the next slide, slide 3.

And this is just a quick overview. So you can see what we've established here in Orlando. We have a website. Everything is online, and you can submit your application on our website. It takes us one to two business days to process the applications, because we receive those via separate email once we will send the customer a request to upload their plans for the project.

And once we receive those plans, we will go ahead and review those plans, route it to the different departments. It takes about five to seven days. The plans, once they get approved, they pay for the plan. Permits get issued. At that point, the contractor can begin to work on the plans. He needs to schedule his inspections. For finals, he schedules his final inspections once they're completed and approved, I issue a certificate of completion.

And that's the streamlined, and recognize what we would be looking for permits, we'll go over that real quick. We'll go over to the next slide. We will need site plans. So as the locations of the equipment, electrical plans. And if it's in a building, we'd like to see building plans.

Next slide?

Site plans, we want to see location of equipment, the changes in elevations and striping, change in the parking spaces themselves, where they're located, and how the they're dimensioned. Curbs and/or wheel stops, and the bollards that they might have for physical protection from vehicle damage, accessible regular charging spaces that they're required, and site survey.

In the next slide, there's an example of a site survey. This one was permitted. And so you see the utility company provided that.

The next slide?

And we have electrical plans. We want to see the power source location, provide electrical one line diagram. Show the raceways, conductor sizes, overcurrent protection. Load calculations, the listing of the equipment that it's in the United States and is acceptable, and the manufacturer's installation instructions. So the installer knows how to install it, and our inspectors can inspect it properly.

The next slide, we'll go to building plans. If it's located inside a parking structure, we want to provide construction plans, identify the construction type, equipment details, and the installation instructions. And we want to validate accessibility. A lot of times on commercial properties we're going to need to ensure that we meet a minimum criteria when we this service is provided. So we want to make sure it's barrier free, has accessible route, protection, and reach range for someone with disabilities to get to the controls.

The next slide shows you typical nice picture, installation accessible stalls, got bollards for vehicle protection, those green things in the back. And then we show you an example of what wouldn't be an accessible route for someone with a disability to be able to utilize this piece of equipment. It gives us an idea of how we look at the world.

Then when I'm looking at the next slide, I'm just inside of a parking garage. And I see some things that are good, some things that are bad. I look at this and I see accessible parking space. It has appropriate signage. I don't see physical protection of the electrical equipment inside the parking garage, which we would anticipate. It's an accessible stall. We would anticipate wheel stops, or more so bollards, something of that nature that would not impede direct access to someone with disabilities. And then we would look at these other stations, how they're distributed along the electrical.

So the next, what type of inspections is now we're going to look at the inspections that we would require. The electrical rough-in inspection or underground, depending on the surface mounted or buried. Get a pre-power inspection, and then we'll get a final inspection. Engineering would run simultaneously as a style case. And if there a building case, that would run simultaneously as well to schedule those inspections.

The next slide shows some photographs of electrical inspections via underground inspection. On the left, we want to make sure that the breakers are identified and that we have access to the electrical equipment. I think that's an important thing, especially for any emergency responders, if we do have any hiccups that we can ensure that they're a safe installation.

The next slide I got is a link on our website. And I don't know if it's a hot link. You can click on that, but it's a step-by-step process with hot buttons that you can click to submit your forms, and walk you right through our process.

So if you have any questions for me, I'd be glad to answer them.

Bridget Gilmore: Thanks so much. Appreciate you doing that, Roy, making it work through the phone in your own presentation. That was great. Yeah. That's good resiliency, love that. Yeah, I think we do have some other questions that I can bring everyone back up for if we would like to do that. Sorry for the back and forth. But I think that was great to get to hear your real-world experience of what you're looking for as you're looking at these permits.

I know there's a common question across all of your presentations as well as I think things that you've touched on, but it would be interesting to hear your perspective, Roy, if there's any lessons learned, or if there are any processes that can be streamlined further, things that you could see going any faster, or do you feel like this is the flow chart is what it is.

Roy Eden: Yes, thank you. There's many lessons learned through this process. And I'll try to break it down to keep it simple. But the truth of the matter is that not all EV stations are the same, as residential is separate from commercial. And when we look at the application, the different size of equipment, and then we also have to look at the location and where we're installing those

So engineering approval for the site is probably your first stop. And validating your electrical, the homework that someone may have to do in an existing facility, if they're using existing panels to ensure that we don't overload an electrical system which can be unsafe. We want to make sure that we ensure that load calculations are correct. And we check the size of the cables for voltage drop and for the distance they're running, and that we can properly service the equipment.

Some of the things, lessons learned, we've learned a lot of lessons when it comes to providing access, providing different types of scenarios in parking garages, things of that nature. What those construction types, if it's a post-tensioned job or if it's Rebar, and where the power source is, but a lot of lessons learned so far.

Bridget Gilmore: Great. Thank you for that. Yeah, Alisha, Courtney, are you are you both still there? I know there's some additional questions that have come in. One for you, Alisha, is if you could give an example of what approvals are needed for the EV charging infrastructure at the state, county, local levels that need a dedicated pathway. Are they related to the equipment specifications? So I think, wondering what's maybe missing in the dedicated pathway at this time.

Alisha Lopez: Well I know definitely when I've worked with a lot of our local stakeholders, one of the biggest things that I've realized is the lack of education. So them actually knowing what a level 1 charger is, what a level 2 charger is. So even though permitting departments have their certain processes. But if they don't necessarily know some of the background information, OK, yeah, how many voltage does this thing have. How many kilowatts do I need here for that? How many spaces do we need?

So I always suggest first doing maybe a little bit of background information, because definitely here in South Florida it is very different across all municipalities, all counties. So it can be very trying for the installer, especially like I said, if you get awarded for the NEVI fund, trying to work through these different local governments to accelerate the permitting process. There is a bill which I noticed that was in the Q&A that has been introduced into our state legislature for the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services for our state Energy Office, to actually develop a state standardized process for electric vehicle charging.

And I know that it's passed already three committees. So right now, we're closely watching that bill, since I think that could definitely change the game for us here in the state of Florida. I think it could either, one, definitely help since it would be a standardized process. Everybody just has to go through the same steps to get it approved. Or it could preempt local governments from actually putting in infrastructure. So it's definitely an interesting time to be in Florida right now, I would say, regarding EV infrastructure.

I don't know, Courtney, if you want to give some experience for you, but other maybe cities, counties, that you've worked with.

Courtney Ferguson: I just think, again, it's just making contact, early contact with the utility and with the AHJ and what their requirements are. And again, yeah, I think Roy touched on it with engineering our team to know how they need to design this, what kind of load capacity, exactly what the voltage what the watt is for each charger, what the full capacity that is needed for the station is very important.

So, knowing, I guess again, us communicating exactly what the project is with these two different entities, with the utility and with the AHJ, and then also then communicating back to us on what we need as requirements. Again, because there's a lot of needs with licensing, registrations, and then just as a contractor standpoint of what we need just to even be able to work in that state or that jurisdiction, and then actually start the project itself.

Bridget Gilmore: Great. Thank you.

Roy Eden: Understood.

Bridget Gilmore: Go ahead, Roy.

Roy Eden: Well it's just all sites aren't the same. Like we have floodplains and when we have equipment, electrical equipment in a floodplain, it becomes challenging. So you may select a site that you want to make sure that you've checked the FEMA flood maps and know the elevations that the equipment would have to be. It may be so high, it's not accessible. So some of those challenges do exist. And we've run into some of those.

Bridget Gilmore: I guess, a similar question of the case-by-case nature of permitting, one person is wondering if there are differences in fleet charging permitting as compared to publicly accessible charging equipment, how that permit process might be different.

Courtney Ferguson: On my end, the applications are the same. Oh, I'm sorry Roy. On my end, the applications are the same. But I think as it progresses with someone like Roy on the building Department, it's how that is approved. And Roy, I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Roy Eden: Oh, no. You're fine. You're fine. I didn't quite understand the question with recharging. Are you talking about maintaining them?

Bridget Gilmore: I think the question is basically public versus private charging infrastructure. So if you're trying to get a permit for a fleet of vehicles on private property, what that permit process might look like versus publicly accessible charging infrastructure at a parking garage or something of that nature, how those would be different.

Roy Eden: Well, they're different as far as, like a residential we would look at that separately. And we just look at that as installing equipment. And residential a 1 and 2-family dwelling is different than we would look at apartments and commercial. The International codes have a little bit more detail in the criteria of where it applies based on the classification of the building.

So when we look at residential in the building code, we look at residential. 1 is a in a hotel or a motel. And R2 is, say apartment buildings, condominiums. R3 is 1 and 2-family dwellings less than three stories, and R4 would be classified as an assisted care living where people are sleeping. So we look at the code through different eyes of how we classify buildings and what the use is, if it's intended for sleeping.

Bridget Gilmore: This is another question for you, Roy. At the top of your presentation, you noted that the adoption of codes is three years behind the technology. And they're wondering if you could give a real-world example of where this impacted the design, permitting, and inspection stages of a project.

Roy Eden: Well, when we look at the tools that we have available in our box with the Florida building code, it's modeled after the international codes. So right now, we're on the 2023 edition, and they're working on the '27 edition. So by the time we adopt a code, it's three years old.

And that's just part of the code process, as the codes change every three years. So because Florida itself hasn't adopted the international building code, we amend it through the Florida building code.

Bridget Gilmore: Got you. Courtney, a question for you. Was there any sort of example project that you saw where the permitting was really smooth, and what about that process stood out?

Courtney Ferguson: I think online portal submission truly has elevated this process. You could just upload the documentations. There's comments back. But again, it's on their end. They also aren't just dealing with EV charging permitting. There are also other projects happening in that jurisdiction.

So I think just whatever their load is, what they have, how many projects they have to get through. Sometimes there's just better times of the year, how that works I think it's on their end. But I will say definitely the online submission is the streamline of this process I think on both sides.

Bridget Gilmore: And I know one question had come in that I think Alisha was answering, but do you have any recommendations for any jurisdictions that might not have the same resources at their disposal to also have a streamlined process?

Alisha Lopez: I did try to type a little bit of a response. But I was definitely thinking if they can't necessarily afford maybe a payment portal, or automate anything maybe on the website, but definitely having a checklist maybe online. That could be easy to upload just as a PDF. Definitely, having it readily available within the office, so if they have to come and drop off a paper application or have questions, all of that is there.

I was also thinking about along the lines of if there's two departments that have to review it, having them review it concurrently. Because that's already staff that's there, that the salaries are already paid for. So not necessarily going out of the box on that one. And one of the other things I was thinking is definitely that communication, speaking with the developer, whoever it is that's coming with the permit and actually telling them, hey, OK. We're a small office or however long it's going to take, but definitely establishing those timelines.

So that way, because I know it can be hectic too when they're consistently calling the office and trying to figure out when a permit is passed. But to me, I've been a very big fan of open communication and transparency. And I think that really does help, especially when you have, let's say, a smaller office with not as much staff.

Courtney Ferguson: I agree. Yeah, we absolutely as a contractor, don't want to be bothering the jurisdiction. We feel like that might put us at the bottom of the list. But again, it's the communication, if we can get that line. Because that's usually what we say. Call back in two weeks. Then we just put it on our calendar. Say, OK, just follow up with that. Because, again, we all know. We're all fully aware like everybody's running full speed in this EV space, and let alone any kind of other permitting that needs to be done. Everyone wants their project done today, right?

So I think it's developing that relationship. And I think through that process, I've made some really great friends. And it's really nice to know that if I have another project in that city or that township or that county, I can reach back out to that person and it really does make everything a lot smoother, especially with inspections and final inspections. It just helps developing that relationship from the very beginning.

Bridget Gilmore: That's great. I guess one final question, we have three minutes remaining in our hour. Have you all seen any permit applications that have looked to incorporate solar panels and battery storage into the design? Is that something that your office has seen, Roy?

Roy Eden: Yes, it has. We've seen a few of those. Or you see utility has installed those, some on the rooftop of their garage. And we have a full station downtown with level 2, level 3 chargers. And in the bus, we have electric buses here. So they also installed that. But they're finding that the power that they need isn't sufficient from the solar energy. It's an insignificant amount of power compared to what they need for the charging stations.

Bridget Gilmore: Yeah. Good real-world experiencing how it works in practice. Yeah. Any last thoughts before we transition to our resources from Courtney or Alisha? Any parting wisdom on permitting?

Alisha Lopez: Honestly, I just wanted to thank you all for inviting us to speak, and thank you for everyone attending. And please feel free to reach out to me. If you guys need my contact information, I am definitely a resource. And if you have a local Clean Cities Coalition, reach out to them. They can definitely help.

Bridget Gilmore: Awesome.

Alisha Lopez: I just want to thank everybody for the invitation and also for joining us. This has been a great discussion. I think this is, again, one of the hot topics of EV is permitting, as well as the utility engagement. And I think standardizing permitting will help I think everybody across all the states in every jurisdiction of knowing what to expect and how to deal with this in going forward. So thank you.

Bridget Gilmore: Well, thank you all so much. So yeah, here are some of the resources that were mentioned in today's webinar. Feel free to check them out. We'll have the PDF version of the slides later on. And we do have some upcoming webinars on Thursday. Actually, we'll be doing a webinar on zoning and building codes, so related in some ways to the nitty gritty of how EV charging installation happens. And then we'll also have a webinar on curbside EV charging strategies in just a couple of weeks.

But finally, if you didn't get your question answered, I know we still do have some in the Q&A, please do feel free to submit it. This was something that Emily had mentioned. But we have a contact form, driveelectric.gov/contact. You can reach out for technical assistance. You can let us know if you have a remaining question, and we'll have our team behind the scenes that's there to help respond as fast as possible.

But just want to say thank you all so much again. Thank you to our panelists. It was great to have you all here today. And thank you, Roy, for your flexibility of navigating technology. But I hope everyone has a great rest of your day.

Roy Eden: All right.